Blinx: The Time Sweeper (videogame soundtrack)

MusicBrainz
,
1

Hello, I am aware of a couple releases of the soundtrack for this game, and I’m wondering what the current guidelines are on this (here is an older related thread)

the 3 versions are in different audio formats, so I’ll refer to them by that

mp3 version
found here (both games) and also here (1st game; 2nd game)

seems fairly widely distributed, and 1st game already has a mbz entry here

raw adx version
raw audio from the game discs, in original adx format (not a midi kinda thing; it’s printed audio)

can be obtained from this archive on hcs forum

pretty much just a pile of songs

image
image749×692 39.1 KB

flac version
judging from the included notes, it’s pretty much the above adx audio rendered to standard pcm and structured + tagged

fairly widely distributed; there are several copies on soulseek. I got it here, directly from the person who encoded it

for each game, the tracks are arranged into two “discs”, and a screengrab of the title screen is used for artwork

image
image1900×1188 142 KB

questions
which of these should be entered into the database? would they be entered in as a bootleg, with the included artwork + tags? or entered in as like the game disc itself, with the original box artwork (like here or here)?

edit: removed dl links at moderator request

1 Like
2

Yay, vgm! Always complicated, but fun to enter!

I would enter all three (because why not imo) - based off what I can tell the ‘raw adx version’ would be official, representing files/music in the actual game disc, the other two would be bootlegs (one step removed from the game disc contents). For the ‘raw adx version’ I would add the game release date, and game packaging artwork. For the other two you will most likely be leaving release date and artwork blank (though sometimes you may have that data/it may exist).

I’m working on a vgm soundtrack guideline draft, that includes game-rips. Have a look and see if it’s helpful (and please let me know if there’s something missing or that could be improved): User:Aerozol - MusicBrainz Wiki

2 Likes
3

thanks for the info! not sure if I have enough experience to give meaningful feedback, but I will read through and go off of those guidelines

4

I’m not sure I agree with your assessment. You typically have to do things like decrypt and decompile huge binary blobs to end up with native video game audio formats like CRI ADX. I would not classify such a rip as “Official” status as such a rip is most certainly not endorsed.

1 Like
5

links
these links are broken:

image
image1066×186 9.98 KB

shared recordings

Game-rip recordings should follow this format for the disambiguation: [ripper name] [console] game-rip

so no recordings should be shared between the 3 releases?

loops
one consideration is loops. many of the adx files include loop markers that allow a portion of the track to be looped seamlessly. so when converting to pcm, you could loop anywhere from 0 to infinity times

sounds like it would be good to put the number of loops in the disambiguation:
Editor “yindesu” - MusicBrainz (search “loop”)

1 Like
6

Hmm, if the file names and structure has been changed then I agree. I was making some assumptions from @Thermospore saying they were ‘raw audio’ from the files tbh.

That said if those file names match what they are on-disc, and the lengths etc as well, then I personally would be happy to store it as ‘official’. In the same way that we store vinyl as official even though you have to rip a blob of vinyl to get a series of digital files/tracks, and we wouldn’t add individual vinyl rips to MB. But if there’s unique rip decisions being made made on how to cut up the audio and so on, then definitely not official for me either.

But if you don’t want to face controversy @Thermospore then you might want to add the ADX release as a bootleg as well. Note that in that case, and in many game-rip situations, it may not ever be possible to get a ‘original release date’ on the release group/your files, that matches the video game release date. Not using MB, anyway. That’s something you’ll have to make peace with early :pray:

2 Likes
7

honestly I think I’m in over my head a bit, but I got a basic entry for 1st game flac version going at least

should release group be merged with this one?

1 Like
8

Thanks, fixed!

No, if the recordings are the same length and sound the same, etc, they can be merged imo.

I updated the draft guidelines to read:
“Unique game-rip recordings should follow this format for the disambiguation: [ripper name] [console] game-rip”

Does that help?

Loops do come up often with vgm - if you have an efficient idea for how they could be added to the guideline that would be welcome!

Personally I think it might be getting too technical. For it to be filled in the ripper needs to have shared how many loops they recorded (or we have to listen and check against an original game file), which I haven’t seen often.

I suppose there is the case where you want to merge two identical game-rip recordings that use the same amount of loops… but that must be verrry uncommon :thinking:

9

Perfect!! Not over your head at all :grinning:

This is not a solved question yet - as the decisions are split/there is no guideline you are free to group your additions as you will.

I tried to discuss and lay down some guidelines for this question here (no consensus):

10

2nd game flac version added as well

1 Like
11

ok gotcha. tbh I’m only just now solidifying the concept of recordings/works/etc in my mind tho haha

I think it wouldn’t hurt to add the number of loops in the disamb if it’s relevant or if you happen to know, but probably not needed most of the time?

@yindesu probably has some thoughts on this

1 Like
12

I’ll probably hold off on adding the adx one for now, until there is a better idea of how it should be classified etc, but someone else is welcome to add it if they want!

13

I would put all the things in the annotation - the disambiguation we usually keep to the minimum needed to disambiguate from identically named entities.

I add mainly modern soundtracks so I haven’t gotten neck deep into the world of loops… as you keep editing stuff don’t hesitate to offer guidelines or guides. Maybe you’ll find we really do need to have a disambig for loops.

1 Like
14

It might be better to start a new thread if you’re looking for feedback on this, but here are a few terminology suggestions:

  • I’d avoid using the word “ripped” in “‘ripped’ from in-game audio” due to the much more common existing definition that seems like it applies to the “extracted from a game disc” case. Maybe “recorded” instead?
  • The guidelines use the term “game-rip” without defining it. Game rip (audio) - Wikipedia just points at the “Ripping” article, so Wikipedia is no help. If this is meant to refer to the unofficial releases of in-game audio described earlier, I’d recommend introducing the term at that point.
2 Likes
15

Loops apply to modern soundtracks, you can’t just ignore them. Per the Style Leader, tracks with different durations because the VGM is allowed to run longer before fade out are separate recordings. The examples I listed all come from official commercial CDs, not bootleg gamerips.

This is another reason why native game files, like MIDI files, aren’t a good fit for the MusicBrainz database schema, since the ability to change the looping and fade out means that each track on the release actually corresponds to more than one MusicBrainz Recording.

1 Like
16

I personally don’t know where I stand on merging or not, but if you don’t, I’d add a link between the two, either in both annotations or as a release group – release group “includes” relationship like I did for the SimCity 4 soundtracks to the game release group (which includes the music as plain MP3s). that way others who come along later can find all the different release groups, tho this could also be done with a series for all the different release groups

17

yea there are a lot of different situations for audio source I think. not sure to which degree they should be differentiated

  • official separate soundtrack release
  • soundtrack stored in plain & easily accessible format in game files
  • soundtrack directly extracted/decoded from game files
  • soundtrack captured/recorded from game while it’s running
  • even further, internally vs externally recorded (ex locally capturing windows audio from a PC game vs recording a console into a PC with an adc)

and of course some games store their soundtrack as raw printed audio, while some generate the soundtrack from instructions (like midi)

1 Like
18

Maybe there’s a misunderstanding, we don’t ignore loops. We split anything that’s a different length into a new recording (btw I wasn’t sure what you were referring to re. listed examples?)

The question here was, does it have to be added to the disambiguation guidelines, e.g. would you encounter this situation often:

A song title (Aerozol Switch game-rip)
A song title (Aerozol Switch game-rip)

Where each of the above recordings is a different number of loops.

Recording =/= audio extracted to a computer-playable file, in the MB database scheme.

e.g. We store vinyl and hand-cranked media (wax cylinders), where any rip on your HDD will always sound different.

I don’t think it’s out of the question to have them. I don’t have any to add myself anyway… personally I think if @Thermospore or others are keen to add those files I think we should try enable it. If Thermospore doesn’t really care, then all good.

This makes me think of:

image
image597×628 104 KB

MB can build shelves for peoples weird audio shit :stuck_out_tongue:
But have to make sure it doesn’t break anyone else’s shelves and that the guidelines make sense.

3 Likes
19

khinsider mp3 release stuff
I was assuming the khinsider page I linked for the blinx 1 mp3 release was the original source/upload, but I’m now thinking it isn’t. khinsider is also missing the associated rip of blinx 2 (the blinx 2 rip hosted there is a decade newer, and by a different person). I can’t even find a tracklist for that blinx 2 rip, but I found the artwork here on this info page, as well as on soulseek and a couple other pages

image
image750×750 67.2 KB

the description of this youtube video says the artwork (presumably both of them) was made by someone named davocrazy

now I’m not sure if this release should represent the original mp3 bootleg, or the release/post of that bootleg on khinsider. probably should be the former, which means I should revise this edit I made?

also, from @aerozol in the above edit:

Nice! I don’t think anyone has a problem with merging the release groups of these bootlegs by the way. If you want.

I want to merge them all (including the official release, assuming it has the same ‘core’ original recordings), that’s what’s debated :slight_smile:

sure, I can merge the two release groups. personally I don’t mind merging an official release as well. the core recordings are the same (the bootlegs are basically just those adx files transcoded to flac/mp3)

speaking of which…

raw adx version stuff (official release?)
ok personally I quite like the idea of an official release (ie listing the adx files + box artwork etc), but I think it’s becoming more complicated

for both blinx 1 and 2, some audio tracks have both an adx (stereo) file and a aix (5.1) file. there are also music videos / cutscenes in sfd format (raw video; similar to mpeg I think). some videos have the audio track (music and or dialogue) built into the sfd file, while others store it in an external adx/aix file (usually but not always with the same filename)

this brings up a lot of questions for a musicbrainz release of this. for example:

  • which files should or should not be included (pure music, jingles, sfx, mixed music/dialogue, pure dialogue, etc)
  • how they should be named/formatted (raw filenames? extensions included? or use fan names?)
  • how should they be ordered/structured?

the original link I posted is missing several things, from both discs. it seems necessary to look at the original discs for a complete list / ordering of all the audio/video files. the blinx fansite (I assume I can’t link, but it can easily be found) hosts many of these files if you want to take a look with minimal hassle

anyways, this is a lot more complex of a situation than I had assumed

1 Like
20

thoughts? (see edit notes for details)

1 Like