I see, so I will use a standardised format for Disambiguation. Should I use exact location or only the part from the album title? (‘Waldbühne, Berlin, Germany’ or ‘Berlin, Germany’)
Should sponsors be included? (“Nikon at Jones Beach Theater”)
I tried to add the venue with “recorded at”, but struggled with the location. As it is an “event”, I probably have to add a new one for each concert, but do I really have to add the setlist?
Your explanation is very detailed and very helpful indeed. Thanks!
It’s a complex database and the interface isn’t very intuitive, but I know, that’s not easy to achieve if there are complicated tasks to perform… (I suppose, there are no MB training courses available…)
It will take some time to get familiar with it.
Nice videos, thanks!
I should have watched them before starting with edits. But some hints are still helpful now. For example I haven’t noticed the Guess Case button for the track lists. Would have been helpful for “Back to Front” title capitalization. And will be, as there are two more to come!
For the disambiguration the pattern seems to follow the same as live bootleg naming (live, YYYY-MM-DD: Venue, City, State/Province, Country). Though that varies around the database and I have often seen it without the venue. Sometimes cut to just (live, YYYY: Country). Depends what is available on the cover really.
With PG I was mainly using the covers as a guideline. Meaning I didn’t often have the venue, so was just City, Country.
Never seen the sponsor added.
The most important bit will be that date. That way if people are looking at a long list of recordings they can tell the difference quickly. And also spot if something has come from the same gig.
This is a confusing one. Look at how there is a PLACE and an AREA type. If you know the arena, then click on PLACE and search for the arena by name.
If you don’t know the arena, then click on AREA and search for the CITY by name.
No need to make events for this. (Unless you are a masochist… that Event GUI is beyond weird and clearly not used much. It has a very odd editor with no preview mode. So every edit you make gets stuck on a 7 day queue and you will not know until the end of the 7 days what your edit looks like! I gave up trying to add events long ago…)
Aha… scripts. Or Userscripts as they should be called. Or how to make the MB GUI actually useful and informative. And how to speed up many editing tasks. This is a HUGE area of conversation to go into. I am no expert, but happy to help explain what I use and why.
But then I also didn’t realise how much was missing from the main GUI. Or how different everyone sees this GUI due to different scripts. Due to a script, I see the disambiguration text on every recording every time it is listed. VERY handy on these gig pages. So handy I assumed that everyone had that view… but maybe they don’t.
I’ll make a few posts later about the userscripts I use and what I think they do for me.
You will have noticed my screenshots look different to yours. This is due to the scripts adding extras to the pages.
As you can tell, I like helping out. Especially if it is improving something like the data in this database. And the Peter Gabriel stuff deserves if. Also by helping I find I better understand the features myself. I also am more used to forums where there is a real community on it. I always find MB’s forum weird from that viewpoint. Some people are too quick to criticise.
The interface is totally insane to someone not used to relational databases. A little bit too much geek in the design, and a few too many hidden guidelines. The userscripts will help a lot for many parts of the interface once we start to talk about them. Too many editors have forgotten how script laden their GUIs now are. Everyone has their favourites and it may even make more sense for us to start a new thread about scripts.
The great thing about the MB pages are they are very customisable. The scripts add in many missing features that make editing so much easier. I the few years I have been here I have seen various discussions about redesigning the website, but they seem to get too complex and then don’t happen. (But I don’t want to start people on a thread about that here…)
Great! Don’t know yet which of the scripts will be useful for me, but I tested Import from bandcamp successfully (more or less)*
What do you use? Do you write your own scripts?
But perhaps this really should be another thread.
… and this probably too:
*) I’ve got a huge problem handling the artist Emel (Mathlouthi), because she’s from Tunisia and her first release was entirely Arabic script. So is her name in MB. If I search in MB for the artist with Latin script, I find nothing. The bandcamp import filled in “Emel”, but it was not possible to get a match. Everywhere We Looked Was Burning - Release group by Emel
I have a short list of Scripts I use. Don’t yet write any. One of the main ones is from @jesus2099 as it adds so much more to the GUI. (INLINE STUFF)
Search some of those in the forum and you’ll find the thread with better details about them. I often thrown things in when I see a discussion about them. Or I am finding I need to do something like import from Discogs.
Happy to try and explain them where required in plain English.
I can offer to have a look. See where I can assist. Maybe we can pull something off with an import script. Does the release appear on Discogs? iTunes? Or just solve it with some heavy copy and pasting.
No more Peter Gabriel from me…
I mainly searched this thread out today to say I am now unsubscribing from Peter Gabriel completely. it is too depressing to see that “Remove relationship” guy deleting so many relationships from the concerts.
Now if the MB database allowed the lookups to work, it wouldn’t be so bad. But the database is lacking quite a distance behind what a human eye can process. Seeing all those “Remove the relationship” edits appearing in my Subscribed list is both annoying and depressing (yeah, I know this is my own personal problem). I added the links to the towns and concert halls so people using this database from the outside could look up “What was recorded at Wembley”. Gets too depressing seeing that all deleted now. So it is goodbye PG.
Note - one of those scripts does add a link to the corner of the page. There is a “test.musicbrainz.org” website which is the database that you can go and experiment in without actually leaving any trace. the place to experiment without causing damage.
Sorry, I checked again. A match can be found but you have to “Show more…”. And you have to know how Emel Mathlouthi reads in Arabic letters. … and I was confused by the second “Emel Mathlouthi” artist. Probably it was created because of problems with Arabic script. (it’s a new edit)
You do not use any import scripts, do you? Or are they included in one of the other scripts?
(is Violentmonkey better than Greasemonkey?)
(in fact it was the first) - The cover of the Back to Front Winter 2014: 08.12.14 Aberdeen, UK is an adapted version of the spring show cover. Above the spring tour show list a separate sheet with winter tour dates is attached and, as there is a special winter tour layout, a symbol inserts the word “Winter” into the title. (see scan images)
That’s a considerable “bootleg feeling” for an official release
I have Discogs import script. Not sure where that comes from. (see below for more details)
I don’t buy digital music so no iTunes \ Deezer \ etc. And Amazon is such junk data I rarely use it.
I add scripts at random when I find a use for them. Or some massive time savers like the one to apply the same recording dates en-masse. Or applying bulk (disambiguration).
I use ViolentMonkey as I have the Chromium based Vivaldi as my main browser.
The Test DB is handy if you are worrying about something. Though my personal method has always been to just pile in and do the work on the real data. You learn much more by fixing your own mistakes.
Interesting to see the comments about your new Peter Gabriel buys. It is these kinds of details I have had a lot of fun with as I find them. I like obscure bands and some of the research I have chased in to because I wanted to check a date is fascinating. Or chasing down who that obscure person was who played the tambourine on a track. Funny how many characters can link bands together. And as I am working on an obscure band it is usually easier to have time to correct any mistakes that may occur.
EDIT: Not sure why this has been flagged as abusive \ against guidelines. I would be really curious as to what I did to upset someone. Please let me know what it was that offended you and I will correct it. PM me on the forum and I will keep you comments anonymous.
You will often find duplicated artists. If someone is adding a compilation then they rarely know much about all teh artists on that compilation. So a new artists gets created. It is then left to an editor who knows more about the artists to later merge them together.
I also see it happen a lot if I am adding in all the different instrument players, producers, and various people who appear on the average CD credits. I’ll often do this with Discogs open as the Dsicogs script adds lots of cross-links back to the MB database making entry so much quicker - but that is when duplicates can stand out.
Import Discogs releases to MusicBrainz - VERY handy. Especially as it add lots of pink buttons to the Discogs pages linking back to the same data at MusicBrainz.
Not only linking Releases, but also Artists and many other items of data.
This relies on those Artists and Releases at MB having the Discogs links, but they are usually in place.
Other scripts I am using from that list include:
MusicBrainz: 1200px CAA (for when artwork is 60MB PNGs and I want to just have a quick look for reference on screen)
Fast cancel edits (Handy when I mess up a large list of edits… lets me click CANCEL EDIT quickly down a list without opening a window for each cancel)
Set recording comments for a release (Great for Releases of concerts like PG. It lets me set the same disambiguration to all the tracks in one quick press of a button. MASSIVE time saver as otherwise that is hundreds of clicks to add that data to every track on a release)
MusicBrainz UI Enhancements (put more of the data up on screen. Making the pages more informative. Think that is why I get the disambuggeration text on my Release pages)
Thanks, I’ve added “Set recording comments for a release” already (not used it so far). I will try the others as well.
Duplicates are probably unavoidable. The problem I see, is that this special artist is no longer Tunisian local artist Emel Mathlouthi with Arabic characters, but the international artist EMEL and even her full name is written in Latin script (writing credits). Has it always to be the name of the first release?
I ask, because I like to merge another artist, Rebekka to Rebekka Karijord, or vice versa?
I would clearly prefer digital media, if it’s lossless and if it would be accompanied by a digital booklet. These are rather rare.
So I buy lots of CDs, have to wait for weeks until can to listen to the purchased music (if no additional download is available) and then I use the CDs once before adding them to my chaotic archive, where I can search for the booklet, if I’m interested in details (whilst listening to music from hard disk drives).
But the situation is getting better, so thanks for the Discogs hint, it will be helpful.
Seems a certain to merge those. Merge Rebekka into Rebekka Karijord. Always merge to the better quality target. When looking at Rebekka that one release is clearly part of Rebekka Karijord’s catalogue as seen on Wikipedia. It is her first release.
When merging artists you get a question about “Update matching artist and relationship credits to use the target artist’s name”. In this case you will not rename as “Rebekka” should be used as an alias here as that is what she used on that album. So leave that box unticked.
This is why I scan the booklets in full and upload them here at MB. It means I have the booklet ready to read on screen without digging the CD out of storage. By uploading it here at MB I do the double task of having an Internet based backup that will download via Picard. And more importantly - I am sharing with the community.
… thanks for all the information! I like to add them one by one to see what they actually do.
That’s what I like to do with all new albums, but I have loads of CD booklets and a really slow scanner*. I probably need a more powerful device for this purpose. (But then I could archive my CDs ordered by release date, which will be much more expandable than my alphabetically ordered archive. )
I will not mess it up this time. And I checked the album cover for writing credits - all Rebekka. (there would be a 16 page booklet to scan…)