New release has wrong recording artists?

musicbrainz
recording
release
Tags: #<Tag:0x00007f2a00ff51f0> #<Tag:0x00007f2a00ff4f98> #<Tag:0x00007f2a00ff4d40>

#1

I am trying. I just added a new release called “Affinity” via the Add Release option.

  1. The release artist is Les Neish, no problem.

  2. Per the style guide for classical pieces, when using the Tracks import box, I specified the classic composes: Vivaldi, etc. No problem.

  3. On the Recordings page, I need to specify that they are all new recordings, by there does not appear to be an option to specify the release artist, Les Neish. No problem I think, I can change them after creation.

  4. After creating all the new recordings, on editing them all (ie changing the incorrect artist/composer, to the recording/release artist), all are now in moderation for a week!

How should I create the new recordings so that they have the correct recording artist, without having them quarantined in moderation for so long?


#2

@lantresman, thank you for being so diligent in entering this Release. Care like this is what makes MusicBrainz so useful.

A trick for adding a release, where the Track Artist and Recording Artist should differ:

  1. Add the release, and fill in Recording Artist in the Track Artist fields. There will be no recordings yet.
  2. Submit that first edit.
  3. Let MusicBrainz create new Recordings corresponding to the Tracks. The Track Artists will be used as Recording Artists. Now you have Recordings corresponding to the Release, and the Recording Artists are correct, but the Track Artists are wrong.
  4. Edit the release a second time. This time update the Track Artists to the correct values.
  5. Note that the Release Editor has checkboxes to instruct copying Track changes to Recordings. They are unselected by default. Leave them unselected.
  6. Submit that second edit. The Recordings do not change, and are still correct, but now the Track Artists are also correct.

I hope this is helpful for you.


#3

There is a similar trick if you want to change the recordings, but not the tracklist: Make the changes, select “copy titles to recordings” and/or “copy artist credits to recordings”, select “make all edits votable”, submit. Then cancel the edit to the tracklist.


#4

@Jim_DeLaHunt Thanks for that, I can see where I went wrong, and obvious now that I think of it. Thanks.


#5

OK, when adding another release, on the Recordings tab I definitely left unchecked “Copy all track artist credits to associated recordings”, but all the recordings ended up with the track artists anyway. I’ve just changed all the incorrect artists/composers to the recording/release artist, and now all the tracks are stuck in purgatory for another week.

It is mad that I also have to wait a week for my own edits to recordings that I added just 10 minutes ago, have to wait a week before being auto-approved, and will show the wrong information until then.


#6

I’m hearing you say that when you first added the Release, the Recordings ended up with the Track Artists. Do I understand correctly?

When you first add a Release, there are no Recordings yet. When MB creates new Recordings, it re-uses the Track Artist as Recording Artist. There is not a way to prevent this, as far as I know.

The checkbox “Copy all track artist credits to associated recordings” only has effect on a subsequent edit, where you change the Track Artist value, and Recordings are already linked to the Track. Then MB consults this checkbox to decide whether to copy the new Track Artist value to the Recording.

Does that match your observations?


#7

Yes, you describe it exactly. I guess I was surprised that the checkbox “Copy all track artist credits to associated recordings” only works after editing, and not creating recordings. I just wanted to make sure that I haven’t missed anything, and if this is how it works, then so be it.


#8

Well, we can’t have recordings with empty artist fields, so it has to use something when you first create them :slight_smile:
Very useful thread, thanks guys!


#9

So this seems to be a UI bug in the Musicbrainz Add Release feature. When there are no recordings, Add Release must copy track artist credits to associated recordings. Therefore, this checkbox should be checked, to indicate the copying will happen, and disabled, to indicate that a user cannot change that behaviour.


#10

Would it make sense to have an options to:

“Copy all release artist credits to associated recordings”

Ideally it would be great to be able to specify the artists for each recording, but this would be a step in the right direction.


#11

I’ve add a feature request, to use the release artist for all new recordings.
"[MBS-9134] [Add Release | Recordings: Copy RELEASE artist credits to all associated recordings]"


#12

It works when adding a new release if you’re reusing existing recordings for it, but it doesn’t do anything when adding new recordings since there are no recordings to do anything to until the edit has been submitted.


#13

Actually, I’d argue the user’s conceptual model is different. From the user point of view, they are telling MB to create a release, which has track artist credits, and to create corresponding recordings. Of course the track artist credits are copied to the newly-created recordings as part of this operation. So, according the user, this box should be checked.

It may be that the MusicBrainz code sees this operation as several “edits”, and that one “edit” which creates the Release doesn’t yet have any Recordings to copy to, while the Recordings are created as part of a different “edit”. The user won’t be aware of this. It looks like a single operation to them.

I don’t propose a change to the behaviour of the code, I just propose a change to how the MusicBrainz web UI communicates with the user through this (checked, disabled) checkbox.


#14

Agreed regarding the checkbox, if it doesn’t do what is expected, it shouldn’t be available.

But for classical releases, the track artists are the composers, eg. Beethoven, Brahms, Mozart, and I want the release artist, eg. the London Philharmonic Orchestra. Conceptually, this is logical for me. At the moment, I have to create each recording separately as a stand-alone recording, and then attach each to the release recording. Hence the request for a new checkbox to copy the release artist, rather than track artists.


#15

Yes, this request for a new checkbox is the original point of the thread. My comment about improving the UI for the checkbox “Copy all track artist credits to associated recordings” is a side-topic. Maybe I should have spawned a new thread for it.


#16

That wouldn’t really work when adding a release that has a mixture of new and old recordings though. There, either it’s checked by default (causing probably unwanted changes to existing recordings), or it’s unchecked but the behaviour on new recordings is the same (which seems potentially confusing).

That won’t help in most cases - the release artist will be a combination of composers and performers. The right solution is probably to implement something like https://greasyfork.org/en/scripts/20766-musicbrainz-replace-recording-artists-from-a-release-page into the MB code itself.


#17

Another option (just thinking out aloud), is to have on the release Recordings page, editing similar to that on the Tracks page, where we can select and edit the artists for each recordings (like we do for tracks). Being able to copy and paste the selected artists would make this process very quick, before confirming the release.


#18

I think it’s quite unfortunate that there is no straightforward way to enter a new classical release such that it complies with the official style guide.

Maybe a bit harsh, but I think the whole concept of a “recording artist” is flawed. Relationships can do everything that the “recording artist” field can, plus much more like making clear the role of the entry in the field.

Release and track artists have their right to exist by reflecting the credits given on the cover of the release. For the recording artist it’s different. In my opinion, it should just be abandoned / depreciated in favor for the use of relationships.


#19

I’d think that it’d be easier to let the “Add Release” action create those Recordings and then change the Artist of those Recordings afterwards?


#20

Actually I often do what @iantresman says when I want video recordings to be videos straight away, not in one week.
I don’t like having pending words in my collection, it may be the same for him. :wink: