MB as "I love me" Wall

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What do you think about adding artist, without MB entities/relationships, but only URLs to other own web sites/social media accounts.

Sometimes it’s not clear at all, if the artist is somehow relevant and music related.
Maybe something will come soon.
Since there are URLs such artists are not deleted automatically, if I’m correct.

What do you think about this specific case?


I voted “No”, based on formal rules (wrong sort name).
However they contacted me directly (“Hello, we noticed that you see “No” at #72196784 …”).

https://musicbrainz.org/doc/Artist:

An artist is generally a musician (or musician persona), group of musicians, or other music professional (like a producer or engineer). Occasionally, it can also be a non-musical person (like a photographer, an illustrator, or a poet whose writings are set to music), or even a fictional character.

To say it clear: I see no relevance for “Chris TDL” in MusicBrainz by now and so I t think we should not keep this artist.

BTW: See also https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q98426789 (deleted because of spam / advertising).

His music appears to be available on Amazon and Spotify:


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OMG! :face_vomiting:
(I cant not listen to it: no account, Firefox, … – and I don’t want listen to it!)

However: I would keep my “No” vote for the “Add Artist” since the sort name is wrong …
… but now he tried to change the sort name (edit #72218532).
What about this change? Is this correct? IMHO not, since the sort name doesn’t fit the artist name (but there is no clear rule for that).

BTW: But at least some (all?) URL’s from him are not correct/relevant on MB, I guess. I hope!

I think “Christopher Alexandre Taylor” should be added as a legal name alias, and the sort name should be the same as the name: “Chris TDL”, analogously to “Bow Wow”.

I think he might might need some help in adding his stuff. Not everyone has the time and energy to familiarize with MusicBrainz, which is a rather complex system. Although, if he really is an “Artist Manager & Computer Scientist” an aptitude may be presumed. I agree, what he is putting out there looks bogus.

“Net Worth Space Inc. is a media company subsidiary of CH TDL Company include Net Worth Space website and the Net Worth Space Inc. Corporationand founded in April 2020 by Christopher Alexandre Taylor ( Chris TDL ). Our objectives are to make information easy and authentic via new” – https://medium.com/net-worth-space/about

LOL. What?

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This isn’t good voting etiquette - even if an edit is partially incorrect we try to be nice to new editors!

I personally don’t mind artists like this being added, as long as there is plenty of information available to identify them (e.g. this one is much more useful than a ‘Chris TDL’ with just a single broken myspace link or similar). IMO we are not going to run out of room in the database :slight_smile:

Even if someone is just trying to aggressively self-market themselves as a internet guru (just a hunch…) it doesn’t really matter to MB. HOWEVER, I would definitely vote no on something like the medium link which seems to have nothing directly to do with his music. I will watch the artist too.

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I don’t agree to this.
If an artist is not “a musician (or musician persona), group of musicians, or other music professional” (or another relevant person, as stated in the Artist doc) he is not relevant to MB.
Since this guy also acts as an “artist”, with his own soundtrack to his own movie, with tribute to himself, he might/must be accepted as artist – even if this might deride real artists and music professionals.
However, it’s not acceptable to add info or link to sites which are not related to music/art/etc. in any case, but is just ordinary advertisement for other stuff/business.

BTW: To someone “lying to us in French as to who he is” I feel free to use a lowly voting etiquette.

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Restricting the database to “Real Artists” and “Music Professionals” quickly ends up excluding e.g. hobbyists, who definitely deserve entries.

The tone that’s being used here also feels inappropriate for engaging with first-time editors, no matter if they are editing their own profile for reasons of self-promotion. Harassing a new user for misunderstanding the purpose of the database and/or a minor sort name problem does not paint the community in a good light.

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IMHO this is an unsuitable foreshortening and not excluding hobbyists.
We should not take care if an artist (generally a musician, etc.) is an amateur or a professional or something between.
“Other music professional” it part of the documentation.

It is okay for artists (regardless of amateur or pro) to do self-promotion in a way of entering their own artist entity, releases, songs, etc. It’s also okay to provide relevant links to somehow music-related sites of him.
However, if, e.g. an (hobby-)musician is also working as an insurance salesman it’s not acceptable for me when he add advertising links for insurances.

If an editor is using a fake name (and acts as artist in self-promotion) – but maybe also this is not true – it’s suitable to use clear words.

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because of what I saw on Wikipedia (before I came here), I have often spoken against the low threshold that MB has.
And now, over the last year (before CoVid) what I see on Wikipedia, many “influencers”, “entrepreneurs”, youtubers, and tik tok’rs are abusing the weaknesses found on editable sites far worse than any “vandal” could.

The availability of troll farms is making things that much worse.
We aren’t talking ‘dark web’ stuff. You can search google and get a ‘how-to’ for this stuff - inventing a brand. SEO kind of stuff.
And with musicians - the availability of free music software, allows anyone to create “music” based solely on keystrokes and mouse clicks.

=======================

As to this case specifically, Chris TDL has music on Spotify. Regardless of how bogus his “brand” is, he has music. MB, and their low threshold, has no reason to remove this guy. All we can do is make sure his edits are formatted properly.

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It’s not MB’s job to make these kind of judgements - the only thing we ask is “has this entity got a legitimate connection with some kind of legitimately released music (or sounds…)”

That’s what I said in my post :slight_smile:

Not all musicians release music.

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Man, MB keeping me on my toes every day!!

…including being connected in some way to releasing noises to an audience’s ears, or in sheet form, etc etc :wink:

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This is an extremely outdated attitude, music is music, no matter if from a symphonic orchestra or a random person pressing buttons on a gameboy (the latter is in fact an entire genre).

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Until you find someone who is making a 2-minute sine wave solely so he can post it to soundcloud, so that he can be on MB, so that he can be given an ISNI, so that he can be included on Wikidata, so that he can have a Google Knowledge Graph.

THEN, you see the flaw in the system.

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Like everyone else responding to this thread, I too agree that this artist deserves to be on MusicBrainz. That kind of elitist attitude belongs on the English Wikipedia, not on MusicBrainz.

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I’d be really interested in how this works (i.e. how having a Musicbrainz listing helps in getting a ISNI)
Is there a document online that you can provide a link to?
I looked up ISNI on Wikipedia but it was not helpful.

Getting an ISNI doesn’t seem that hard.

ISNI had been using MB as “part of” the identifying process - meaning they needed to match an MB entry with entities on other sites. Which wasn’t too hard, since we already collected much of the information they use.
But they have graduated to issuing numbers based on MB alone. At this point, they aren’t yet issuing numbers to every MB entry. There still needs to be a certain amount/type of data on the entry (such as a song writing credit). But no longer does an entry need, as example, a corresponding Discogs link.

The sad part, they said in a TED Talk that they would like to start issuing out numbers for YouTube accounts. Which is one of the reasons why they are talking about changing their numbering system - simply too many entites to handle the current scheme.

I didn’t realize they started selling numbers. But that link is a 3rd party site, so I wouldn’t take much stock in it. It could be (I didn’t read closely) a situation where a service is free but if you pay me I will do the work for you.