Series numbering: alternative punctuation mark


#1

I have two edits, both received a no vote.

Edit #48384135
Old: Polyethylene (parts 1 & 2)
New: Polyethylene, Parts 1 & 2

Edit #48461657
Old: Mona Lisas and Mad Hatters, Part Two
New: Mona Lisas and Mad Hatters (Part Two)

Are we still standardizing part/volume numbering?

I’ve done a quick search for punctuation marks and pretty much all seem to include parentheses as one.

I had a similar discussion concerning subtitles (this was a over a year ago), and I was voted down. My stance was that subtitles were standardized (Title (The Remixes) should become Title: The Remixed) ). Part of my argument was how similar the rule is to Part/Volume guidelines.


Should we follow the guidelines if we don't agree with them?
#2

By my interpretation of the current guidelines, I don’t consider “(” to be similar to a “?” or “!” ending the title, separating it from the part. The latter would remain with the addition of the “,” the former is replaced by the “,”.

I’m certainly open to the guideline being changed, much how we stopped expanding abbreviations for Pt, etc. but I think that the “,” standardization is the intent of the current guideline.


#3

Attaching the current guideline for reference.
Your first edit is similar to the Shine On… example below.

Series numbering
When a release or track is part of a series, separate the volume or part name from the title with a comma. If the title already ends with an alternative punctuation mark, such as a question mark (?) or an exclamation point (!), use that mark instead of the comma.

Sonates, Vol. 3
The Best Smooth Jazz… Ever! Vol. 4 (separated by !)
Shine On You Crazy Diamond, Parts I–V
Authority? Pt. 2 (separated by ?)
The Piano Works 3 (no volume/part name, so no separator needed)


#4

Sorry for reviving such an old topic, but I have the same question.
I have seen hundreds of edits replacing “-” or “(” before a “part” with a “,” - especially in recordings, always mentioning the guideline mentioned above.
But in Edit #56169716 I was made aware that the guidelines (taken word by word) actually don’t justify that.
According to Wikipedia “-” and “(” are punctuation marks.

Somehow I still believe that any punctuation mark only counts for release titles, but for recordings only punctuation that ends a sentence (?, !, .) counts. At least that is consistent with what I’ve seen so far in most edits.

So this is how I’d do things:

on album cover in MB
Album [linebreak] Part 1 Album, Part 1
Album (Part 1) Album (Part 1)
Album - Part 1 Album - Part 1
Album! Part 1 Album! Part 1
Song Part 1 Song, Part 1
Song (Part 1) Song, Part 1
Song - Part 1 Song, Part 1
Song! Part 1 Song! Part 1

#5

Imho it doesn’t make much sense to treat release names and recording names differently and since I like consistency I am siding with the guideline here. To add to your argument about seeing people do it like that, I’ve seen people change “-” into “:” in the case of subtitles despite the guideline mentioning alternative punctuation marks. Even though it is listing only “!” and “?”, it is implied that other alternative punctuation marks could be used as well. Therefore I suggested to at least add an example that uses “-” as a punctuation mark (the 3rd example) and I still see people changing “-” into “:” from time to time. I believe the guideline initially was to change everything into “:” (in the case of series everything into “,”) and then it evolved over time, but people still remember the initial guideline.


#6

The bit about alternative punctuation marks has been in the guideline for a long time, for both subtitles and “series numbering”. But most people have interpreted it to just apply to question marks and exclamation points, not to all forms of punctutation. What the original intented meaning of the guideline was I have no idea. I don’t have much faith that whoever wrote the guideline knew what is and isn’t a punctuation mark.


#7

I don’t understand why we should change part into Part nor why we should change everything into a comma.
It seems this guideline is old and comes from a time when we didn’t have relationships to link recordings togeteher as parts of others…